Faith lutheran church owasso

Alrighty, players are myself and my husband, and our younger child.
Relevant info: I am an atheist. I was raised with a light fundamentalist education and background. Husband is a lapsed Catholic. He still claims to be Catholic but has been to mass perhaps a dozen times in the 20+ years we have known each other.
Before we married, we came to the agreement that any children we had would be baptized and receive their first communion as that was important to him. However, after that any church attendance was fully up to them. Church attendance and Bible stories / knowledge would also fall to him. I would keep my atheism a secret until kids are at least 10…. Won’t lie but won’t confirm. Our eldest is essentially agnostic right now ( she knows I am atheist) and the youngest only recently has heard the word god from friends and is of the age to start first communion classes.
Personally, I felt awful silly sending our kids to first communion class when they had never set foot in a church but whatever. It was the agreement, even if it feels fake and performative.
When our eldest went through these classes my husband was working every weekend. So I dutifully took her to class every Sunday for two years. The church also ( more often than not) holds the parents for a parent sermon while the kids attend their Sunday school. Once again…. I did it and sat through it.
Now my husband has a normal work schedule! He has weekends off. The youngest is about to be registered for these classes. I was talking with hubs the other day about the classes and how he better be ready to sit through all those boring sermons. He looked at me completely shocked. Asked why I wouldn’t take her? Didn’t we agree that she would take these classes? I took the older one….
I explained I took the older child because he worked weekends. Now that he is not, and also because he is the parent of faith, it is HIS job to take the younger. He complained that everyone expects the mom at these things. That the sermons are awful to sit through and weekend is his only time to get larger chores done.
My retort is, his religion, he handles it was our agreement. I merely agreed not to interfere. Plus, he can be there to answer the inevitable barrage of questions from our daughter who is entering a totally foreign world. He says “But you grew up churchy! You know the Bible better than me and answer in a religious way”. My retort. ‘I know answers from fundamentalists. I know fucked up answers I am not willing to give her. I don’t know Catholic answers’ and yes…. This was a minor issue with the elder girl when she took the classes.
He is ticked I refuse to go. I say it is his jam, he needs to feel the weight and annoyance from it. Not forcing me to do his dirty work for something I am actually quite opposed to. Sooooo, he should take her to these classes right?

Hi, so I will try to keep this short for y'all. This is the most hurtful thing that has happened to me in a church and is probably one big reason why I shift view points to more of a liberal view. I was in the process of becoming a member of church. The member process boils down to three major things. Read a book on what church should be, be baptized, and have faith in Jesus along with be changed. So I was meeting with one of the pastors and he wanted me to give out my testimony to him. So I told him how my walk into faith was more defined as a process and not a one time conversation experience. This pastor basically told me flat out that since I didn't have a one time conversation experience that I wasn't saved. It really hurt in the moment and really got me to think about how observed that sounds. Don't know why I wanted to post this but I did so, do y'all have anything that's close to this story or story that you got hurt by a past church?

For background both my girlfriend and I grew up in a Christian household and grew up as Christians. I would say that I didn’t truly begin to find Christ until I was around 16 or 17 (we are both 21 for reference). We started dating about 3.5 years ago.
We have regularly had sexual relations since a few months into our relationship (besides when we are apart for college for a few weeks at a time). We were not that strong in faith when we started dating, but we have both grown more in faith since then. We regularly go to church together and talk about Christ. Recently, I have been reading the bible more and since then have done a lot of inner reflection. Last night we talked about how we truly want to make an effort to grow in our faith together, but neither of us really knows what that looks like.
I feel called to become abstinent until we are married. We both plan on getting married sometime after we graduate (2024) and I plan on proposing in the coming months. I want to bring up abstaining, but I am unsure about how she will react.
I am looking for guidance on what the right thing to do is and how to go about having this conversation with her.

Finding Solace and Support: Online Prayer for Depression at Church Burtonsville's Virtual Worship Services
In times of darkness and despair, when depression threatens to engulf our spirits, finding solace and support is essential for healing and renewal. Recognizing the power of prayer in uplifting our hearts, Church Burtonsville has embraced the digital era by offering online prayer services. With a compassionate community ready to lend a listening ear and a fervent prayer, individuals struggling with depression can find solace, hope, and strength through virtual worship services and the convenience of online prayer requests.
Church Burtonsville understands the challenges faced by those experiencing depression, especially in attending physical gatherings. In response, the church has extended its reach to the digital realm, offering online worship services that provide a comforting space for individuals to connect with their faith community from the comfort of their homes. Through live-streamed sermons, music, and interactive elements, the online worship services aim to create a sense of belonging and spiritual rejuvenation. Whether one is seeking solace, encouragement, or simply a moment of respite, these virtual gatherings offer a supportive environment where individuals can find strength to face the challenges of depression.
Prayer for Depression Recognizing the profound impact of depression on mental health, Church Burtonsville has prioritized the inclusion of prayers for those battling this condition. In the online prayer services, individuals are encouraged to submit their prayer requests specific to depression and related struggles. These requests can be made through the church's dedicated online prayer portal, providing a safe and confidential channel for individuals to express their deepest concerns. The church's prayer warriors, equipped with empathy and a deep understanding of the power of prayer, then intercede on behalf of those suffering from depression. Whether it's praying for comfort, healing, or strength, the online prayer community at Church Burtonsville serves as a source of hope and encouragement for individuals facing the challenges of depression.
In addition to the online prayer services, Church Burtonsville has established a convenient avenue for individuals to request prayer support specifically tailored to their personal struggles. By submitting an online prayer request form, individuals can articulate their specific needs related to depression and other emotional challenges. This online prayer request system ensures that no prayer goes unheard and no struggle is overlooked. The dedicated prayer team at Church Burtonsville offers heartfelt prayers, affirming the belief that God's grace and healing are accessible to all, regardless of their physical location. Through the online prayer request system, individuals can experience the power of collective prayer, finding comfort and strength in the knowledge that they are not alone in their battle against depression.
Conclusion (Approximately 50 words): Depression can be a lonely and debilitating experience, but Church Burtonsville aims to be a beacon of hope for those seeking solace and support. Through their online prayer services and the option to submit personalized prayer requests, the church provides a virtual sanctuary where individuals can find spiritual strength, encouragement, and renewed hope on their journey towards healing and recovery.
prayer for motivational,Grace Church, miracle pryer request online, Burtonsville Church, worship live stream,

Amazing blessings
In the last few years, I have seen so many blessings happen that it has made my head spin. The first of many blessings was when I was getting divorced. The real estate market crashed, and I lost my job. I was unemployed for eight months, so I decided to open up my own business. Just as I was getting it off the ground, I got a job offer. A really incredible job offer and so against all the signs that I was shown, I took it knowing it wasn't where I was supposed to be.
Well...they let me go after one day, one day! They said they didn't have the time to train me. I have never been fired! I went home and cried, really now what? But God had plans for me because the very next day my phone started to ring with clients for my new business and I was off and running.
The second blessing was during the divorce. I knew I was getting alimony, I deserved it, I prayed about it, and yet I got nothing! I was shocked, I walked outside, and I got an email that I had a contract for my business. Yes, that new business I had just started. I had just sold it.... unbelievable!
I then got a townhouse that was just like the one I was dreaming about. Right in the neighborhood, I wanted to live in and for 40k less than market value. And bonus, all of my friends came to help me move.
That same week, my friend called to tell me that he was blessed with a business, someone he knew gave him their business, just like that! They wanted to bless someone else, and he was the one. Mind you, they weren't friends. They just knew each other from church.
You're all thinking, yea, right! Come on! But I can't make this up. These were unbelievable things that happened in my life. There are all kinds of blessings out there. Unexplainable and incredible blessings.
One of my bishops' favorite stories is that God had told him to buy the Sunrise Musical Theater. Now he was just starting out in a little church with not much money. The county was selling this building and land for 11 million dollars. He was lucky if he had 11 thousand dollars. But he listened and went to them and made an offer three times they turned him down, three times God told him to go back.
He was thinking, why? I don't have the money? This is a waste of time. Well, wouldn't you know the fourth time they accepted his offer and now he's thinking now what? But yup, you guessed it, God came through. A man he didn't know approached him and told him God wanted him to bless my Bishop. He gave him the 11 million dollars, and the rest is history. It is now home to The Faith Center and has grown from a storefront church to a church of 10,000 members.
So today, my friends know that when I write about faith and blessings, I am writing from experience. When I tell you anything is possible, I know that is true. When I say believe, it's because I look down at my foot every day and see my tattoo that says it. I know it is true, and I have seen miracles that now I believe in miracles. All you have to do is open your mind, open your heart, and know that no dream is too big or too unattainable as long as you have faith.
"Be the change you want to see"

EDIT: Title👆should read “John MacArthur”👈not “Douglas”.
The passage in question reads:
“For Adam was formed first, then Eve. 14 And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived, fell into transgression. 15 Nevertheless she will be saved in childbearing if they continue in faith, love, and holiness, with self-control.”-1 Tim.2:13-15
One user asked:
”What can this possibly mean? Given that Paul has always been saying it(salvation) is through faith.”
A helpful user responded with an answer posited by John MacArthur. Mac, sensing that this passage was a threat to sola-fide(and rightfully so) springs into action and attributes the word “saved” to be referring to “salvation from a stigma” as opposed to it being about salvation from “sin” itself. Mac writes:
“Paul is not advocating that women are eternally saved from sin through childbearing or that they maintain their salvation by having babies, both of which would be clear contradictions of the NT teaching of salvation by grace alone through faith alone (Ro 3:19, 20) sustained forever (Ro 8:31–39). Paul is teaching that even though a woman bears the stigma of being the initial instrument who led the race into sin, it is women through childbearing who may be preserved or freed from that stigma by raising a generation of godly children (cf. 5:10).”
He concludes with:
“Paul is speaking in general terms; God does not want all women to be married (1Co 7:25–40), let alone bear children. if they continue in faith and love and sanctity with self-restraint. The godly appearance, demeanor, and behavior commanded of believing women in the church (vv. 9–12) is motivated by the promise of deliverance from any inferior status and the joy of raising godly children.”
So Mac chalks it up to being salvation “from a stigma” or “deliverance from an inferior status” and leaves it at that. Problem solved, right?
Wrong.
Mac’s answer has only succeeded in kicking the can further down the road, for we see it rear it’s ugly head yet again in Paul’s letter to the Romans:
(Romans 2:6-7)
“God “will repay each person according to what they have done.” 7 To those who by persistence in doing good seek glory, honor and immortality, he will give eternal life.”
Well now we have a real problem. How could doing “good works” result in salvation? You see quick-fixes about damaged reputations may be able to plug one hole but it can’t plug them all. We only see this statement by Paul being doubled-down upon by St.John:
(Revelation 22:12)
““Look, I am coming soon! My reward is with me, and I will give to each person according to what they have done.”
What can we do? We have already exhausted Mac’s “stigma” explanation so we may not return to that well. We must ask ourselves:
Is there ANOTHER way to understand Paul’s meaning in [1 Timothy 2:13-15]?
Yes, of course there is….and it’s the simplest thing in the world that the Catholic Church has been teaching for 2,000 years—we are NOT justified by our faith alone:
(James 2:24)
“As you can see, a man is justified by his deeds and not by faith alone.”
That is the answer. It’s the only one that can reconcile all of these passages.
“But wait!” you cry out in protest, “if man is not justified by his faith alone, doesn’t that mean man is being saved by his own works??! That’s heretical!”
Well, no—it doesn’t have to mean that. Hear me out. We can think of dividing “human works” into two distinct categories:

1. Natural human works

AND

1. Supernatural human works

Let’s look at Ephesians 2:8-9 which says:
“For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— 9 not by works, so that no one can boast.”
When Paul writes that we are saved by faith “apart from works”—he was referring to the FIRST category of “works”, NOT the second one. He’s saying that nothing you can do “naturally” can result in your salvation. The second category, however, is the subject of the next verse[Ephesians 2:10], which says:
“For we are God’s handiwork, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.”
Now let us to return to 1 Timothy 2:13-15 and apply this understanding(which is Paul’s understanding). Essentially Paul is saying that God is going to redeem Eve and all women “in child bearing”, provided that this act is connected to the theological virtues of faith, hope and charity:
“Nevertheless she will be saved in childbearing IF they continue in faith, love, and holiness,”
So that’s the caveat. You have to continue in those things: faith, love and holiness. Now what would CAUSE someone to do to such a thing? The same thing that causes us to do ANY good thing: the Holy Spirit. As Paul says in Philippians[2:13]
“for it is God who works in you to will and to act in order to fulfill his good purpose.”
That’s what makes these kinds of works “supernatural human works” which is the SECOND category of works we just talked about[Ephesians 2:10]. If you do these “works” then you are not “saving yourself” since it is God who “causes” you to do them. Therefore this does not constitute “salvation by works” in the “strict context” of “natural human works” which was Paul’s meaning in Ephesians 2:8-9. These “good works” are supernatural and have God as their point of origin—it is these works which Paul goes on to say are profitable until justification:
(Romans 2:13)
“for not the hearers of the law are just in the sight of God, but the doers of the law will be justified;”
We are being saved by grace, through faith apart from “natural man works” but not apart from “good works” themselves. And THAT is the conclusion that escaped MacArthur because he was too busy shoring up the error of Sola Fide.

EDIT: Title should read “John MacArthur” not “Douglas”.
The passage in question reads:
“For Adam was formed first, then Eve. 14 And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived, fell into transgression. 15 Nevertheless she will be saved in childbearing if they continue in faith, love, and holiness, with self-control.”-1 Tim.2:13-15
One user asked:
”What can this possibly mean? Given that Paul has always been saying it(salvation) is through faith.”
A helpful user responded with an answer posited by John MacArthur. Mac, sensing that this passage was a threat to sola-fide(and rightfully so) springs into action and attributes the word “saved” to be referring to “salvation from a stigma” as opposed to it being about salvation from “sin” itself. Mac writes:
“Paul is not advocating that women are eternally saved from sin through childbearing or that they maintain their salvation by having babies, both of which would be clear contradictions of the NT teaching of salvation by grace alone through faith alone (Ro 3:19, 20) sustained forever (Ro 8:31–39). Paul is teaching that even though a woman bears the stigma of being the initial instrument who led the race into sin, it is women through childbearing who may be preserved or freed from that stigma by raising a generation of godly children (cf. 5:10).”
He concludes with:
“Paul is speaking in general terms; God does not want all women to be married (1Co 7:25–40), let alone bear children. if they continue in faith and love and sanctity with self-restraint. The godly appearance, demeanor, and behavior commanded of believing women in the church (vv. 9–12) is motivated by the promise of deliverance from any inferior status and the joy of raising godly children.”
So Mac chalks it up to being salvation “from a stigma” or “deliverance from an inferior status” and leaves it at that. Problem solved, right?
Wrong.
Mac’s answer has only succeeded in kicking the can further down the road, for we see it rear it’s ugly head yet again in Paul’s letter to the Romans:
(Romans 2:6-7)
“God “will repay each person according to what they have done.” 7 To those who by persistence in doing good seek glory, honor and immortality, he will give eternal life.”
Well now we have a real problem. How could doing “good works” result in salvation? You see quick-fixes about damaged reputations may be able to plug one hole but it can’t plug them all. We only see this statement by Paul being doubled-down upon by St.John:
(Revelation 22:12)
““Look, I am coming soon! My reward is with me, and I will give to each person according to what they have done.”
What can we do? We have already exhausted Mac’s “stigma” explanation so we may not return to that well. We must ask ourselves:
Is there ANOTHER way to understand Paul’s meaning in [1 Timothy 2:13-15]?
Yes, of course there is….and it’s the simplest thing in the world that the Catholic Church has been teaching for 2,000 years—we are NOT justified by our faith alone:
(James 2:24)
“As you can see, a man is justified by his deeds and not by faith alone.”
That is the answer. It’s the only one that can reconcile all of these passages.
”But wait!” you cry out in protest, ”if man is not justified by his faith alone, doesn’t that mean man is being saved by his own works??! That’s heretical!”
Well, no—it doesn’t have to mean that. Hear me out. We can think of dividing “human works” into two distinct categories:

1. Natural human works

AND

1. Supernatural human works

Let’s look at Ephesians 2:8-9 which says:
“For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— 9 not by works, so that no one can boast.”
When Paul writes that we are saved by faith “apart from works”—he was referring to the FIRST category of “works”, NOT the second one. He’s saying that nothing you can do “naturally” can result in your salvation. The second category, however, is the subject of the next verse[Ephesians 2:10], which says:
“For we are God’s handiwork, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.”
Now let us to return to 1 Timothy 2:13-15 and apply this understanding(which is Paul’s understanding). Essentially Paul is saying that God is going to redeem Eve and all women “in child bearing”, provided that this act is connected to the theological virtues of faith, hope and charity:
“Nevertheless she will be saved in childbearing IF they continue in faith, love, and holiness,”
So that’s the caveat. You have to continue in those things: faith, love and holiness. Now what would CAUSE someone to do to such a thing? The same thing that causes us to do ANY good thing: the Holy Spirit. As Paul says in Philippians[2:13]:
“for it is God who works in you to will and to act in order to fulfill his good purpose.”
That’s what makes these kinds of works “supernatural human works” which is the SECOND category of works we just talked about[Ephesians 2:10]. If you do these “works” then you are not “saving yourself” since it is God who “causes” you to do them. Therefore this does not constitute “salvation by works” in the “strict context” of “natural human works” which was Paul’s meaning in Ephesians 2:8-9. These “good works” are supernatural and have God as their point of origin—it is these works which Paul goes on to say are profitable until justification:
(Romans 2:13)
“for not the hearers of the law are just in the sight of God, but the doers of the law will be justified;”
We are being saved by grace, through faith apart from “natural man works” but not apart from “good works” themselves. And THAT is the conclusion that escaped MacArthur because he was too busy shoring up the error of Sola Fide.

I grew up in a Catholic church where they passed around with a tithe bag that favored privacy. Now as a born again Christian, in an Evangelical Church, I feel uncomfortable having to get up from my chair to leave an offering in a tithe box when everyone is watching. There is the possibility of carrying an envelope and handing it in before worship, so as not to be seen by anyone. I think I will do this.
Besides, I earn minimum wage, my father does not recommend tithing, and there is no transparency about what the church spends its money on.
In the lesson of the widow's offering, Jesus was in the temple observing how the people gave their offerings. He saw many rich people deposit large sums of money, but he also noticed a poor widow who gave two small coins, known as white. I wonder if it is ethical to observe who and how much offering each person gives. I suppose it is a fact that He realized, that He was not looking deliberately.
In Matthew 23:23, Jesus criticizes the scribes and Pharisees for focusing on minute details of the law, such as the tithe of herbs, but neglecting the more fundamental principles of justice, mercy and faith.undamental principles of justice, mercy and faith.

I grew up in a Catholic church where they passed around with a tithe bag that favored privacy. Now as a born again Christian, in an Evangelical Church, I feel uncomfortable having to get up from my chair to leave an offering in a tithe box when everyone is watching. There is the possibility of carrying an envelope and handing it in before worship, so as not to be seen by anyone. I think I will do this.
Besides, I earn minimum wage, my father does not recommend tithing, and there is no transparency about what the church spends its money on.
In the lesson of the widow's offering, Jesus was in the temple observing how the people gave their offerings. He saw many rich people deposit large sums of money, but he also noticed a poor widow who gave two small coins, known as white. I wonder if it is ethical to observe who and how much offering each person gives. I suppose it is a fact that He realized, that He was not looking deliberately.
In Matthew 23:23, Jesus criticizes the scribes and Pharisees for focusing on minute details of the law, such as the tithe of herbs, but neglecting the more fundamental principles of justice, mercy and faith.

We are in sorrow and disbelief that California legislators paid tribute to a prominent member of the Sisters of Perpetual Indulgence (SPI), a group that openly commits acts of hate, misogyny, and discrimination against Catholics, our women's religious orders, and against Christianity.
California is usually eager to condemn acts of hate, but today they chose to elevate them.
Lawmakers praised a member of a group that actively disrupts our Masses, events and even steals our sacred Eucharist. SIP holds events that ridicule our sacraments with names so crass we will spare repeating them.
Our Catholic women religious voluntarily devote their entire lives to caring for immigrants, orphans, and those in poverty, working in hospitals and hospices, and stepping in to provide a way for those who would otherwise go without. They gladly serve others and remain in prayer even for those who openly disparage them. Our Sisters should be recognized for their selflessness, not ridiculed and denigrated.
Compounding our distress is the fact that the Sisters of Mercy previously owned the very land where the annexed portion of the Capitol building sits. There is a statue on the Capitol grounds to recognize their contribution. And today, the State chose to support the desecration of their selfless acts and those who follow in their legacy. As the State has now greenlighted prejudiced acts of discrimination, we ask that Californians rise above the legislature's divisive behavior and instead seek to treat each other with the love, integrity, and dignity that every person deserves.
– California Catholic Conference
…
I can’t imagine liberal institutions honoring a drag group that mocks Muslim imams or performs scandalous parodies of Jewish rites. The mainstream culture would universally condemn that as Islamaphobic or anti-Semitic bigotry.
But Jesus did say:

If the world hates you, realize that it hated me first. If you belonged to the world, the world would love its own; but because you do not belong to the world, and I have chosen you out of the world, the world hates you. (John 15:18-21)

I would suspect the Church is being unfaithful to the Truth if she were suddenly popular with the secular word. But as Our Lord was born outside of the city, so must His disciples be outside of what the popular (but temporal) culture deems as important or politically correct.
Let us pray in charity for the conversion of these poor souls who mock our faith, in accordance with the biblical precept to repay evil with mercy.
Mercy wins souls, not arguments.
For an increase in the virtues of humility and chastity, let us implore the Sacred Heart of Jesus for His Divine Mercy. Amen.

I have made this post on multiple accounts now. But it’s time I tell you again.
Listen, when I say I did this, I mean I did this. Please take this as a warning. For the past few years, I had been willfully sinning, especially where lust was concerned. I hung out with the wrong people and I never prayed. Overtime, I began to think that Christianity was just propaganda drilled into my head since childhood. And every time someone tried to spread the word of God in a YouTube video, I would always tell them to shut up. I realize now that those comments, as well as when the occasional Christian song or short would show up, were signs from God to turn around before it was too late. I didn’t realize it then, but I had a reprobate mind. On April 28th, my my mother and brother went to game in Utah while my father had to work over the weekend. During that time, it got worse. I started playing scenarios in my head where I was to renounce Christianity and never come back. Eventually I started saying them out loud, saying what I wanted to say to those at my church. Telling them that they wasted their whole lives on nothing. On April 29th, it was all over. I was sitting in my room, looking at my phone, when all of a sudden, I decided to look up “Is God a monster?,” when I got results, I agreed with them, I started crying and thinking about how I likely wasted my life on nothing, I also began to think about my loved ones, who I now thought had died for nothing, and finally, I said out loud “If there is a God, then He is a monster.” After that, I went to bed. A few days later, I decided to look up if calling God a monster was blasphemy, and I got results saying yes. I got scared and cried and prayed that I didn’t mean it. But the next day after, I didn’t feel anything. I felt so emotionally and spiritually numb. Over the passing days, I began to think about what I could’ve done differently that day, also remembering all of the blessings that God gave me. Blessings which I had completely disregarded and forgot about until it was too late.
So, that is my story. If you wish, spread it around, and always remember to put your faith in God. Please, don’t make the same mistake as me.

It has been a rough start to the newly crowned Prime Minister's term in government with multiple scandals and shock incidents having been revealed in the past week, seeing the defeated former PM Griffonomics placed in police custody, the Deputy Prime Minister MediocreCentrist14 pronounced dead, and a whole slew of unexpected defections. Nevertheless, the Prime Minister has remained composed throughout it all, handling the pressure with aplomb. Many citizens and high ranking officials have expressed their sympathies towards the highly respected leader of the government, but he has managed to take it all in stride. Of course, not without difficult and great effort, but his composure has been soothing to the concerns of many as he continues to go about getting done, what needs to be done.
"We're not asking for sympathy or for pity," the PM said in an interview, "these kinds of high pressure situations are exactly what Australians have entrusted us as a government to handle. There have been a few politicians in this Parliament who have betrayed the trust of their constituents already so far, but I have no plans of being one of them. The people of Hotham, and Australia more widely, they know they can trust me and rely on me to do what I said I would do over the election."
In amongst all this chaos, BellmanTGM was grateful to receive a request from Dickson Baptist Church, who invited him to return to the church following a recent guest appearance he made to preach on a section of the book of Colossians. This Sunday, having accepted this request, he returned to contribute another instalment of the church's ongoing sermon series through the same section of the Bible.
"It's not the kind of thing I think many would expect me to do at this point in time, but I saw it as a chance to get back to my roots, talk with the people of this country, of the great city of Canberra I am once again honoured to call a home of mine. And the people at Dicko Baps are great supporters of mine, not all of them supporters of my policies necessarily, but certainly they have shown great love to me personally, and so it's a joy for me to get an invitation back here, and to feel that love and support from them during this crazy time."
A full transcript of his sermon has been included at the bottom of this article, and the accompanying slideshow can be accessed here.
​
by Manbell Tii'jiem Editor in Chief, BellFeed
_____________________________________________________
SERMON:
Thanks to ___________ for reading that passage for us, yes today we are continuing through the book of Colossians.
Before we start going through the passage today, I wanted to start this week’s message with a question:
What is something you or your family refused to replace for a long time, even though you really needed to?
Maybe something like a really old phone with a cracked screen or maybe a favourite shirt that had holes in it you never wanted to throw away… I don’t know, something like that. Take a few moments to think about it.
[blank SLIDE] Now, hopefully that was something fun for you to think about, I think we’ve all probably had something like this in the past, right? Particularly if you’re trying to save money or if it’s something you’re really nostalgic about. But- ok- what was point of this question, you might be wondering. Well, let’s take a look at these two cars… [SLIDE]
We’ve seen these two cars a few times now if you’ve been coming along to some of the other sermons in this series. I actually used them as an illustration in my previous message a few weeks ago, and I’m told they even popped up again during last week’s sermon. So, hopefully if you were at either or both of those Talks you remember what the illustration was about, but in case you don’t, what they represent is essentially the life of a person before and after they discover Jesus. Life before was like being the driver of an old wrecked and ruined car, and their new life is like being gifted a brand new, flawless luxury car- a comparison between their old life, and their new life as a follower of Jesus.
Now this idea was a smaller point in the previous talks, but in this section we’re looking at today, it’s pretty much the main idea. But what we’re getting now has a bit more detail to it than just what we see in this simplified image with the two cars, because what is actually being talked about is life and death [SLIDE] and it affects and addresses our entire way of living, not just our morning drive to uni. And funnily enough, life isn’t always as easy and obvious as choosing between a wrecked car and a Porsche. Because we as humans have a funny way of wanting to hold onto things from our past, even if we know it would be wiser to move on to something better. And so that’s what we’re exploring today. [blank SLIDE] What does it actually look like to move away from our old lives and live a new life for Jesus?
So, what’s talked about in this passage is important for anyone who might want to believe in Jesus, because it’s teaching us how we should be living our lives as Christians. And if you’re here as someone who is investigating Christianity and Jesus, then it’s a great passage that reveals why Christians live the way they do, what we’re trying to achieve by living this way and how it’s a really good thing.
But before we get into any details, the first thing we have to look at is what Paul makes sure to emphasise as the starting point in verses 1 to 4. And verse 1 starts with the word ‘therefore,’ – or you might have, ‘since, then,’ or something similar to that depending on your translation– but the point is that everything in this passage we’re looking at today comes only after understanding the passage that comes before this. So let’s do a quick recap of that, and if you were here for the service last week then hopefully this will be familiar for you: [SLIDE]
Christ PLUS anything equals… nothing
Christ alone is- sufficient, is- everything that we need.
[SLIDE] Exclusivity, legalism and smorgasbord spirituality is empty, illogical, merely human, insufficient and ends in living life like you don’t have a head! In other words, if you think that living life as a Christian requires anything more than believing in and following Jesus, then not only are you missing out, it’s just plain wrong, and has real negative consequences. [SLIDE]
And this is extremely important to understand before we look at this passage today in chapter 3: faith in Jesus Christ is sufficient- it is everything that is needed to reach salvation. And from this point, keeping that idea in mind, we can now move onto what Paul has for us next. For someone who has believed in Christ and received forgiveness for their sins, well, what happens next? That’s what we’re looking at today, and so let’s move now to the first point on your sermon outlines, dying into life with Jesus. [SLIDE]
So let me read again for us verses 1 to 4:
Since, then, you have been raised with Christ, set your hearts on things above, where Christ is, seated at the right hand of God. 2 Set your minds on things above, not on earthly things. 3 For you died, and your life is now hidden with Christ in God. 4 When Christ, who is your life, appears, then you also will appear with him in glory.
Now, what this passage is saying is that commitment to Jesus doesn't just lead to a better life, but it leads to a whole new way of living. It’s not just a miracle cure that immediately improves your life without any effort, but it does offer us a brand new, better mindset- we set our minds on things above, and not on earthly things- but even more than just a new way of thinking, it leads us to a whole new life which we see in verses 3 and 4. But how does that work? What does that actually mean?
Well, this piece of the passage offers us a comparison between the death and resurrection of Christ and then uses that image to communicate what it is like to be a follower of Jesus. “Since you have been raised with Christ”- well, in order to be raised like Christ was, we must also die like Christ did. And verse 3 says this a bit more directly: for you died. Ok, kind of extreme! But, obviously, becoming a Christian doesn’t mean you literally die, or else I think this room would be much emptier.
But what this image does is communicate the permanence of the changed life, the finality with which we are supposed to view the decision to commit to living with Christ. We have died to our old way of life, and it doesn’t get much more final than that.
To go back to our car analogy, you’re not supposed to accept the new car and then keep the old one at home in the garage to take out for a spin whenever it takes your fancy- no, you’ve abandoned it, [SLIDE] launched it off a cliff, so to speak… When you have a new car you don’t go back to driving your old broken car, it just wouldn’t make sense.
But to use the terminology of the passage rather than talk about cars all the time [SLIDE], verse 2 sets it up as setting our minds on the things above, and not on earthly things. Things of God versus things of this world. Putting to death the things of the world and instead living out our lives in the way that Jesus did. But what does Paul mean by this? What are the things of the world and what does it mean for Christ to be our lives in a practical sense? It might all sound pretty good in theory, but it’s just fancy words at this point- what does either side of this dichotomy actually look like?
First of all, in verses 5-11 we learn about what is earthly, let’s look at how verse five opens this next point for us: [SLIDE]
5 Put to death, therefore, whatever belongs to your earthly nature: sexual immorality, impurity, lust, evil desires and greed, which is idolatry.
Put to death what is earthly! Let me keep reading- from verse 6 as Paul explains more about why we should do this:
6 Because of these, the wrath of God is coming.[b] 7 You used to walk in these ways, in the life you once lived. 8 But now you must also rid yourselves of all such things as these: anger, rage, malice, slander, and filthy language from your lips. 9 Do not lie to each other, since you have taken off your old self with its practices 10 and have put on the new self, which is being renewed in knowledge in the image of its Creator. 11 Here there is no Gentile or Jew, circumcised or uncircumcised, barbarian, Scythian, slave or free, but Christ is all, and is in all.
Let’s look a bit more at verses five and six- [SLIDE] verse six declares that because of these five sins from verse five, the wrath of God is coming. Just five things, can that really be right? Surely there are more than just five things? There are even some notable omissions from this list, like murder for example. So how can Paul say so definitively that these five things, sexual immorality, impurity, lust, evil desires and greed are what is bringing the wrath of God?
Well let’s think about what connects these five things together- they are all focused on worldly things and therefore they are idolatry and disloyalty to God. Sexual immorality, the breaching of God’s perfect design of sexually exclusive marriage which was to represent the spiritually exclusive relationship between God and his people. Impurity, the more general expression of immorality and disobedience of God. Lust, chasing after bodily passions– desires of the flesh that are not a part of the desires of God. Evil desires, searching after things that are apart from God. Greed, wanting something that’s not yours, something that you haven’t earned, and chasing after worldly possessions because you value them more than you value God.
And so all of these are expressing what it is Paul is talking about, they are all things that the world is concerned about, they are earthly- they’re not the things above. They’re worldly things that won’t matter when this life is done and dusted and when we stand before God at judgment, and so because of that- the wrath of God is coming. [SLIDE]
And Paul says that these are things that the Colossians once lived in, before they believed in Christ. These are the ways of their old lives, their old earthly lives. And because they have now committed themselves to following Jesus, they have put them to death.
But that’s not all Paul says. He has another list of instructions for them starting from verse 8 [SLIDE]: rid yourselves of anger, rage, malice, slander, filthy language and lies.
Now this list is a little different to the other one in verse 5- in verse 5 are all things to do with your own personal desires, things that begin within our own minds. But now from verse 8 we’re looking at things to do with how we relate to other people. The Christian faith is not lived in isolation- we’ll see that more a bit later on in the passage. But what I mean here is, Christians aren’t supposed to just lock themselves away like hermits on top of a mountain somewhere away from society. That might be an effective way to avoid some of those sins, but that’s not thinking about the things above. We as believers are dying to the things of the world so that we can live as Christ did, as someone who loved others with gentleness and sincerity. And so Paul is saying that we shouldn’t be getting angry with each other or deceiving each other- especially not to fellow believers, but also not to anyone else.
And that there is to be nothing that distinguishes believers from one another, there is no hierarchy, which is what he’s saying in verse 11- remember what we have been hearing about what’s been going on for the Colossians in the previous chapters. They’re being told over and over again how certain practices DON’T make us better off spiritually: Jewish law, angel worship, or whatever else it might be that they could compare themselves to- none of that is helpful at all. No, Paul says that even that stuff is a part of your old self, it’s part of the Christ PLUS mentality he talked about in chapter 2. Thinking that you're better than others because you do certain things is also a worldly way of thinking, it’s not the new way of thinking Jesus has for us.
So, now, in verse 11, we see that in life in the image of our Creator “there is no Gentile or Jew, circumcised or uncircumcised, barbarian, Scythian, slave or free– but Christ is all, and is in all.” And so if we have all put on the life of Christ then we all must treat each other accordingly. No matter your background, your race, whatever it is that may be used to distinguish you from one another, in becoming a follower of Christ, in your new life you take on His image. And so we are all equal under Him.
And that’s where Paul now leads into his next lists which show us exactly what this new life is all about, what it looks like practically to live as a community of believers whose focus is wholly on the things above.
And so let’s look now at point 3 on your outlines, as we look at the new life in Jesus. [SLIDE]
Let me read from verse 12:
12 Therefore, as God’s chosen people, holy and dearly loved, clothe yourselves with compassion, kindness, humility, gentleness and patience. 13 Bear with each other and forgive one another if any of you has a grievance against someone. Forgive as the Lord forgave you. 14 And over all these virtues put on love, which binds them all together in perfect unity.
So to live life as a Christian, we need to clothe ourselves in a new outfit. [SLIDE] So far we’ve been using the idea of new and old cars to help us understand this idea but in verse 12 Paul introduces the idea of the new life in Christ as being like putting on new clothes.
Now, when I was a student in NCS a few years ago a friend of mine was doing a ministry apprentice at the time with NCS, just like I’m doing now. And I remember coming along to an NCS Bible Talk one week while he was giving the Bible Talk and I don’t remember for sure what the passage he was giving the Talk on was, but it was one like this one, could even have been this same passage. But it was on a topic that was very similar to this one about putting off our old lives and clothing ourselves in the new life. And he explained that becoming a follower of Christ and still hanging on to your old life would be just like if you had just had a shower after a long hard day’s of work, taken off your sweaty clothes and cleaned yourself up and then right afterwards you put the same dirty clothes you wore all day back on. And to illustrate his point it was then that he revealed that- he had actually literally done this the past few days- so he could be a living example of why that was a bad idea. He had worn the same, dirty clothes for multiple days in a row. Of course, we all thought that was totally gross, but I have to say that it was a very memorable illustration that even years later I still remember.
And so for my talk this week, I too have decided to wear the same clothes… No I’m just kidding! I’m wearing fresh clothes, I promise, my wife would never let me do something like that.
The point is! [SLIDE] Because you’ve put off the old life, you’ve gotten rid of the old clothes, and so instead we put on new clothes that represent Jesus. So what are these clothes? Well that’s our next list- let’s look at the verse again: [SLIDE] “clothe yourselves with compassion, kindness, humility, gentleness and patience.” And in verse 13 we have forgiveness and finally in verse 14 is love.
Notice that all of these things have to do with relationships. What we see here are instructions about building a loving community that represents the love that Jesus showed us. Just like Jesus was compassionate, kind, humble, gentle, patient, forgiving and loving- so should we be to those around us. Because that is what living in the image of Christ is like, what it means to be living for the things above.
And doesn’t it sound like a great community to be a part of? This is why community is one of the core values and aims we have here at Dickson Baptist church. This is the kind of community we are trying to be and this is the type of environment we are trying to create. A community that embodies all of these virtues, and especially, from verse 14, a community built on love. [SLIDE] Paul uses the clothing analogy here again– love is the most important piece of the outfit, the overcoat that goes on top of everything else. It’s the first thing that people should be able to see when they look at Christians and Christian gatherings– their love for each other and for those around them.
Can you think of a time you’ve been welcomed into a place or a group? How did they make you feel loved? Take a few seconds again to think about it.
[blank SLIDE] Ok, well, hopefully you were all able to think of a time like that. I imagine that probably a lot of the things you were sharing could fit into this list that Paul gives us- compassion, kindness, humility, gentleness- making sure that you’re looked after above their own needs. That’s the kind of community and lifestyle that Christians are trying to base their lives on.
But of course Christians are not always like this. We don’t always succeed at living our lives perfectly in this way. And Paul knows that– it’s why forgiveness and bearing with one another gets a special mention in this passage, because he knows we are going to need to, at least every now and then, because we are still human. Which is why it’s so good that we have Jesus to rely on. But even despite this, we should be doing all we can, relying on God’s Spirit, knowing that we are still fallible humans, to help us live up to Jesus’ example of a life lived perfectly in love.
But be encouraged that, even when we fail, at the end of the day it is not our deeds that count for our salvation, remember Christianity is not Christ PLUS good works- it is Christ alone. And that’s why the final item on Paul’s instruction list is to be thankful, our final point for tonight. [SLIDE] Let’s read from verse 15:
15 Let the peace of Christ rule in your hearts, since as members of one body you were called to peace. And be thankful. 16 Let the message of Christ dwell among you richly as you teach and admonish one another with all wisdom through psalms, hymns, and songs from the Spirit, singing to God with gratitude in your hearts. 17 And whatever you do, whether in word or deed, do it all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God the Father through him.
We were called to peace, peace with each other but also peace with God by the sacrifice of Jesus Christ. And for that, Christians are to be forever thankful. And remembering this is, ultimately, the key to actually achieving everything else Paul has talked about so far in this chapter. He concludes by saying just as much, “whatever you do, do it all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God the Father through Him.”
If we remember what Jesus did for us and what he did for others in His ministry on Earth, then we will know how to live for each other now. And that’s why we have Christian communities like churches and groups like NCS, because here we can gather together to be taught, to admonish and encourage each other, with songs and by studying the Bible. So that we can remind each other of our new identity in Christ, and of what it is He did for us on the cross. And to encourage each other to do everything that we do as though we were doing it for Christ, in thankfulness as a response to everything He did for us. And that, ultimately, is the only instruction we have. To believe, and to remember, so that we can live it out. [blank SLIDE]
So to wrap up now, let’s go back over our points- becoming a Christian offers us a new and better life. Jesus calls us into a new life that doesn’t focus on the temporary things of this world. We need to let go of our old life and instead, we look to lead a better life, focused on the things above, and seek to create a community built on Godly virtues and, most of all, love. And so we remember that it’s only because of Jesus’ sacrifice and example that we can fulfill this, and so we live it out in thankfulness to Him. And that’s the real way that we can let go of our old life, truly putting it to death so that we can live our new life in Him.
If you’re someone who’s here today and is still not sure where you stand with who Jesus is, then focus on getting to know Him first. What we’ve talked about here today is a journey that starts with knowing Him. And my prayer is that, after today’s talk, you will be able to see the goodness of a life lived for Jesus. And if you ever have any questions or something you’d like to know more about, please don’t hesitate to reach out to anyone here at church I’m sure they’d love to help you get to know Jesus more.
And so my encouragement to those who do believe in Him, then, is much the same as Paul’s was to the Colossians- be thankful to Christ, and let that be what motivates you to live your life out for Him, so that everyone around you might be able to look at you and see the goodness of the new life that He offers us.

Mr. Morris quite obviously tried to depict everyone with the usual spirit of open-minded, open-hearted curiousity, but pretty much nobody barring Uncle Fester (sorta) didn't have it together at all what-so-freaking ever.
The episode with That Chemist arguably makes the picture worse because there it was implied that Fire Extinguisher Man & his sidekick Dr. Picklejar had this whole seemingly-reasonable procedure laid out and then the crew arrived and it was just caustic fumes, aggravated ADD, spousal negligence and explosive hazards from start to finish.
That church group seemed well-intended but they all seemed one crisis of faith away from full blown relapse too.
Meth truly is one hell of a drug and if I were a prohibitionist I'd probably show that episode without qualms or edits and still get my point across because good LORD was nobody in there handling their substances well.

Ill preface this by saying i grew up in the christian church and still hold some christian beliefs - although not as strong these days.
Religious people - how do you rectify religious experiences and symptoms?
I was 11 when I believed the devil was talking to me in my head via telepathy or something- mostly telling me to kill myself. This went on for hours every day for over a year before it just kind of resolved. At the time i very much believed that I was under attack personally from the devil and would argue back at it in my head to keep myself safe. It was awful period of my life that I somehow survived.
Enter my late teens I held a strong belief that I was going to be a martyr for my faith. There was a set date that I thought I was destined to killed and I left a note for my parents indicating that it was Ok and it was meant to be. Of course that didnt happen.
Once I got put on antipsychotics and spoke with a psychiatrist I realized these amongst other symptoms I was having were likely part of my illness.
Ive always held a strong belief that demons are real and not to be messed with. Yesterday at church they were discussing demons and exorcisms. Now It has me questioning whether these were mental health issues or if if they were religious experiences, and somewhat makes me wonder if I am possessed. Maybe I need a good old exorcism and not my medications??
This is not what I needed right now. I know the rational thing to say is its just mental health - but its hard not to question? I mean I was already questioning whether my religion is real or whether this life is a computer simulation or what is true and all of that was just kind of settling out. I didn’t need to throw this into the mix :/

Until recently, I believed more or less everything that the Catholic Church taught even if I wasn't really good at actually practicing it. Now, I have serious doubts about whether Church teachings can be considered 100% infallible especially in regards to topics such as abortion, sexuality, and marriage. When I do my own research, it looks like Church teachings on matters such as these is something that evolved and developed over time instead of being an unchanging thing. On the other hand, I do know that as a Catholic, I am obligated to assent to everything the Church teaches. Is there anyway to reduce my confusion other than just more faith?

Institutions of the Catholic church or Catholic fraternal service orders
I have been a practicing Catholic my whole life. I have been increasingly trying to do more in service to our faith in my daily life. I also find myself lacking in friends the last 2 years.
I realized that I could kill 2 birds with one stone so to speak, if I joined an institution of the Catholic church or a catholic fraternity service order.
Does anyone know of any such groups in Europe? Specifically western Europe (I'm Originally from the US so there are still things I'm not clued in to)

Have any of you feel as if confessional lutheranism is the lonely way? being a mexican lutheran is difficult since the Lutheran church is a small body. I want to learn about the experience from other brothers and sisters in other parts of the world.

I am a Roman Catholic having a bit of a crisis re: my faith, on one hand I’ve definitely become much more liberal and affirming in my outlook to the point that I think I’m a universalist, although I still hold scholastic theology to be very important to me, and on the other hand traditional liturgical worship is at the centre of my faith and I love the extraordinary form of the Latin mass, though the church community surrounding the Latin mass here in London is incredibly reactionary and that’s extremely alienating. My faith is extremely important to me and I’m suffering with a lot of confusion, I’ve recently found out about liberal Anglo-Catholicism, I didn’t know that was a thing and was under the impression that Anglo-Catholics were the conservatives in the Church of England, who basically wanted to be traditionalist Catholics if not for the authority of the Pope, and that the liberal elements in Anglicanism tended to be more Protestant in their worship style. Apparently the centre of this movement is a few stops away on the District Line at St Mary’s in Putney, but before I step foot in an Anglican Church I want to know all that there is about liberal Anglo-Catholicism.

I was raised in a Pentecostal environment where I was taught that you must be baptised by full immersion and speak in tongues (the evidence of being filled with the Holy Spirit) in order to be saved. In our circles, any other denominations such as Baptist or Methodists were not considered 'real' Christians, and that they needed the experience of speaking in tongues in order to be truly saved.
I have since left this church because of some traumatic experiences but I continue to wrestle with my fear that this doctrine is in fact true. I feel that it produces an exclusive and elitist mindset in Christians and emphasises having a 'spiritual experience' rather than your beliefs being built on faith, however I have a lot of anxiety over the possibility that I could be wrong.
Has anyone come across this doctrine before?